28 October, 2009

Jesus vs. Western Culture

Posted by Socrates in Bible, Christianity, East vs. West, religion, Socrates, Western culture at 4:10 pm | Permanent Link

Who will win? Jesus, until Bob Biblethumper is completely surrounded by muds and can’t put food on the table, like in South Africa. Then he’ll have to find a new, Western belief: White nationalism:

[Website].


  1. Similar posts:

  2. 11/05/15 Western Culture: It’s the Best, and the Non-Whites Prove It via Their Actions 49% similar
  3. 10/19/14 Western Culture is Just That 47% similar
  4. 06/07/19 For Newbies: What is Western Culture? Can Negroes and Mexicans Really Become Part of It? 46% similar
  5. 01/19/08 Western “Merit” Culture, or Marxist “Equality” Culture? Britain Can’t Have Both 45% similar
  6. 12/05/12 Western Culture and Women 45% similar
  7. 117 Responses to “Jesus vs. Western Culture”

    1. Eman Says:

      Adam – I asked you this above, but you did not answer: have you ever heard of the website Occidental Dissent? Based on many of your comments here, I think you’d like it – http://www.occidentaldissent.com/

      Your views, especially ones related to technology and the Jewish problem, are very similar to the authors and commentators on that site.

    2. Tim McGreen Says:

      Tom, you’re obviously a follower of the Baby Jeebus, so why not just come right out and admit it…..Unless your faith in him is starting to waver? If I were the Baby Jeebus, I’d certainly be disappointed in your lack of enthusaism for defending me.

    3. Justin Huber Says:

      I was looking through this thread and believe that Hitler’s true attitude toward Christianity as well as paganism (“worship of Wotan”) is found in the Table Talk, which I have read several times. I’m not sure if Blackshirt is really advocating a return to paganism as much as he is just trying to point out that the Jews and other Semitic people don’t have the market cornered when it comes to religion or “metaphysics”, a word that Hitler uses.

    4. Adam Says:

      Eman Says:

      Adam – I asked you this above, but you did not answer: have you ever heard of the website Occidental Dissent? Based on many of your comments here, I think you’d like it – http://www.occidentaldissent.com/

      Your views, especially ones related to technology and the Jewish problem, are very similar to the authors and commentators on that site.

      Thanks for the invitation, Eman. I have visited that site occasionally, but never posted anything there. Maybe I will in the future though. Which writers or commentators there are you thinking of when you say they have views similar to mine?

    5. Adam Says:

      Justin Huber Says:

      I was looking through this thread and believe that Hitler’s true attitude toward Christianity as well as paganism (”worship of Wotan”) is found in the Table Talk, which I have read several times.

      Originally, Christianity was merely an incarnation of Bolshevism the destroyer. Nevertheless, the Galilean, who later was called the Christ, intended something quite different. He must be regarded as a popular leader who took up His position against Jewry. Galilee was a colony where the Romans had probably installed Gallic legionaries, and it’s certain that Jesus was not a Jew. The Jews, by the way, regarded Him as the son of a whore—of a whore and a Roman soldier.
      Table Talk, p. 76

      If one carefully examines what Hitler says in Table Talk about Christianity carefully, it may be possible to reconcile it with his public position approving of Christianity and calling himself a Christian. If the Table Talk is a correct account of his statements on the topics of Christ and Christianity, Hitler believed Jesus was an Aryan who intended something quite different than what Christianity turned into under the evil influence of the Jew St. Paul, who transformed it into a kind of Bolshevism in order to overthrow the Romans. It was this Bolshevik character that he primarily objected to. So he could have been a believing Christian on his own terms — believing in an Aryan Warrior/Christ who wanted to destroy Judaism — without necessarily approving of what Christianity had later morphed into.

      This argument is developed a bit further at the site below.

      From: http://nobeliefs.com/HitlerSources.htm

      Hitler, the Christian

      Throughout his’s life, Hitler showed a remarkable tendency toward conservative faith in God, and saw himself as a reformer and a savior of the German people, and he acted according to his beliefs. He called himself a Christian and spoke in admirable terms about Jesus. At no time did Hitler denounce his own Christianity, and in fact, appealed to Christ as a fighter, just as he saw himself as a fighter. He was baptized, he took the sacraments and received Communion. Was he a devout church goer? No. Did he appeal to prayerful priests? No. But appeals to physical places or the Church hierarchy are not what constitutes Christianity. Christianity does not exist “out there’. It only exists in the minds of certain people who profess a belief in God and Christ. That’s why we can only appeal to the direct words from an individual to determine their belief, and Hitler expressed his belief with brutal honesty.

      Those who vie against Hitler’s Christianity conveniently dismiss his own direct words where he made appeals to God, Christ, and ‘positive’ Christianity. They fail to distinguish Hitler’s Christianity as a belief-system versus “corrupt” organized Christianity. It was the latter that Hitler questioned, not his own personal beliefs. Even more revealing: why do Christians rely on indirect accounts, and only on those which seem to put Hitler in an anti-Christian mode?

      For examples of Hitler’s own views on religion and God, see: Hitler’s speeches & Hitler’s religious beliefs and fanaticism.

      His arguments toward the Christian religion regarded his strong reformation views of the Church as he saw it, regardless of how some Christians today dislike it. Indeed, he saw himself as a reformer similar to that of the alleged Jesus and Martin Luther, the Protestant reformer who also had strong words to say against the Catholic orthodoxy. Reformations always upsets the temper of the traditional believer.

      Anti-religious views by themselves simply cannot be used as an argument against one’s personal beliefs as a Christian, and gives one of the many reasons why Hitler’s Table-Talk, even if valid, cannot serve as evidence against Hitler’s Christianity but, ironically, actually supports his personal beliefs as a Christian.

    6. Tim McGreen Says:

      Adam is engaging in what can best be called RATIONALIZATION.

    7. Adam Says:

      The sites below are quite a treasure trove of information. They develop well and provide a lot of supportive cites for Dr. MacDonald’s argument that Nazism was a kind of mirror-image reaction to Judaism. It makes me wonder if he has seen or utilized these references.

      From: http://nobeliefs.com/hitlerchristian.htm

      Nuremberg Race Laws

      It should also enlighten one to realize that the Nuremberg Race Laws of 1935, signed by Hitler, and according to Julius Streicher, got based on the Old Testament laws forbidding marriages between Jews and non-Jews.

      These race laws forbade marriages between Jews and subjects of the state of Germany and that Marriages between Jews and Germans became invalid. Even extramarital intercourse between Jews and German citizens, or related blood got deemed illegal. These laws began the elimination of Jews from Germany which later escalated into a holocaust.

      During the trials against Nazi war criminals, Julius Streicher admitted that he influenced the racial laws and said the following:

      I have written such articles again and again; and in my articles I have repeatedly emphasized the fact that the Jews should serve as an example to every race, for they created the racial law for themselves– the law of Moses, which says, ‘If you come into a foreign land you shall not take unto yourself foreign women.’ And that, Gentlemen, is of tremendous importance in judging the Nuremberg Laws.. These laws of the Jews were taken as a model for these laws. When after centuries, the Jewish lawgiver Ezra demonstrated that notwithstanding many Jews had married non-Jewish women, these marriages were dissolved. That was the beginning of Jewry which, because it introduced these racial laws, has survived throughout the centuries, while all other races and civilizations have perished.

      -Trial of The Major War Criminals Before the International Military Tribunal, Nuremberg, 1945, Vol. 12)

      If anyone doubts the Biblical laws against marriage, one need only read: Genesis 28:1, 6; Deuteronomy 7:1-3; Leviticus 20: 2, 26; Ezra 9:1-2, 12; Nehemiah 13: 23-30.

      A few of the Ezra verses that Streicher refers to, read as follows:

      Now when these things were done, the princes came to me, saying, The people of Israel, and the priests, and the Levites, have not separated themselves from the people of the lands, doing according to their abominations, even the Cannaanites, the Hitites, the Perizzites, the Jebusites, the Ammonites, the Moabites, the Egyptians, and the Amorites.

      For they have taken of their daughters for themselves, and for their sons: so that the holy seed have mingled themselves with the people of those lands: yea, the hand of the princes and rulers hath been chief in this trespass. (Ezra 9:1,:2)

      And now, O our God, what shall we say after this? for we have forsaken they commandments. Which thou hast commanded by thy servants the prophets, saying, The land, unto which ye go to possess it, is an unclean land with the filthiness of the people of the lands with their abominations, which have filled it from one end to another with their uncleanness. Now therefore give not your daughters unto their sons, neither take their daughters unto your sons, nor seek their peace or their wealth for ever: that ye may be strong, and eat the good of the land, and leave it for an inheritance to your children for ever. (Ezra 9:10-12)

      We know that the Bible influenced Hitler’s views on race laws because Hitler says so in his own private notes. In one of these notes, Hitler included his religious views of race laws under the outline of The Bible– Monumental History of Mankind. (see the transcript by clicking here).

      Given this frightening information, it should come to no surprise why Christians and even Jews, for fear of condemning their own religion, had not mentioned this embarrassing revelation in their defense against Nazism.

    8. Adam Says:

      For some reason the embedded link in my post above isn’t clickable, at least for me, although its text is in blue. It’s supposed to take you to a transcript of Hitler’s personal notes to his volume of The Bible — Monumental History of Mankind. Anyway, here it is again:

      http://nobeliefs.com/HitlerBible.htm

      I find the discussion on that page, along with Hitler’s notes, both intriguing and confusing. The quote from Disraeli that Hitler alludes to, but does not give, runs:

      No one must lightly dismiss the question of race; it is the key to world history and it is precisely for this reason that written history so often lacks clarity — it is written by people who do not understand the race question, and what belongs to it.

      Taken with his professed intent in Table Talk and his public statements, my conjecture is that Hitler envisioned a day when he could reform Christianity and purge it of its Bolshevism and Jewish spirit. That may be what he’s getting at in his notes here:

      confused and muddled– (Lord Disraeli) Basic Race Law–

      1st consequence. Purification of the Bible– what of its spirit remains?
      2nd consequence. Critical examination of the remainder-

      The author of the web page agrees:

      As for purification of the Bible and its remaining spirit, one can only guess what Hitler means here. Perhaps he means purification of the Bible from Jewish origins.

      Then comes an amazing and revealing statement: “First people’s history (based on) the race law–“.

      This might mean something like: A re-interpretation of Christianity based on race law, and a re-working of it into a worship of the Aryan Warrior/Christ that Hitler apparently believed in.

      The idea that the page author advances that because Hitler thought that Jesus was the Son of an Aryan God, he was excused from being Jewish (i.e., the mischling theory) seems not to accord very well with either the Nuremburg laws or Hitler’s insinuation, above, that Jesus was fathered by an Aryan Roman soldier. But on the whole, there are some interesting remarks on the page.

    9. CW-2 Says:

      While this thread is very interesting can we really afford the luxury of offending and alienating potential supporters? Face facts, debates such as this are little better than rearranging deckchairs on a sinking ship, our time would be better spent instructing others how to swim.

      Most of the ills that afflict the White race are presently beyond our power to remedy. Nothing we do, least of all voting, is going change big jew and globalist’s program of continued turd world mass immigration, moral degeneracy, and economic sabotage. Their policy of gradualism and incremental change has served them well and they intend to continue that program as our numbers decrease and the older Whites die off, so all that remains is a dumbed down rump of wiggers ready to be enslaved, miscegenated or murdered.

      If we are lucky some unforeseen event may provoke a contest of arms. Preparing for that possibility must be our major concern.

    10. Tim McGreen Says:

      Christianity was, for the Nazis, like being stuck between a rock and a hard place. Being pro-Aryan and anti-Jewish, yet at the same time being Catholics and Lutherans in a very Christian country, the Nazis could never wholly embrace nor wholly reject Xianity. They tried to advocate something called “Positive Christianity”, ie, a Xianity purged of its Jewish elements, but to no avail.

      And there were doubtless millions of German Christians who disliked the NSDAP’s interest in pre-Christian paganism and its hostility towards God’s Chosen Ones/The People of the Book. So, as long as there was Christianity in the Reich, there would be trouble. But if the Nazis tried to get rid of Xianity, then they would’ve been condemned as Bolsheviks and that also would have caused a great deal of trouble for them.

      Talk about a no-win situation!

    11. Justin Huber Says:

      Good point Tim.

    12. Adam Says:

      CW-2 Says:

      While this thread is very interesting can we really afford the luxury of offending and alienating potential supporters?

      Face facts, debates such as this are little better than rearranging deckchairs on a sinking ship, our time would be better spent instructing others how to swim.

      The thread title is Jesus vs. Western Culture. Uncovering the facts in this volatile area is difficult; the pursuit of truth necessarily fractious. Nevertheless, I would suggest that, if our race is to have any hope of prevailing, we need to understand the reasons for the current state of Western culture, and analyzing the decay of the Christian religion is a part of that.

      While it’s my view that a mass racist movement among whites is not possible in the current context, it’s necessary to deal with the question since it’s an idea that still seems to fascinate so many. Yet, it is hard to visualize how such a thing could be managed without the skillful use of religion. The sort of fanatic idealism that apparently characterized Hitler’s view of the Aryan Warrior/Christ is something that could be valuable to us, if a way could be found to rekindle it and spread it among white people generally.

      There has not been much work done in this area. We have Dr. Pierce’s tantalizing vision of how such a thing might be done, which he gave us in his book Hunter, and yet that was in a novel, a fictionalized account that left us with no clear idea of how to proceed in the real world. Indeed, the pace of technological change is such that already that book seems dated. We also have the example of something like the COTC, which, as far as I understand it, is a kind of racial religion of the type that Hitler might have been thinking about in his Bible notes that I mention above. Yet its success has been less than breathtaking.

      I think the conclusion is forced upon us that the age of religion is past. As Hitler implies in Table Talk, and as I have in previous threads stated, it is science that is the real opponent of Christianity, and indeed, all religions. The triumph of science as man’s means of controlling and interacting with the world is what has killed God. Although some form of religion will probably be indispensible to the state for managing the mass of people for the foreseeable future, so long as science continues its ascendancy and its material manifestation, the global technological system, continues to expand, its future is grim.

    13. New America Says:

      Socrates:

      One – a reply to Red Skull – still caught in the spam filter.

      Thanks!

    14. Tom McReen Says:

      “Tom, you’re obviously a follower of the Baby Jeebus, so why not just come right out and admit it…..Unless your faith in him is starting to waver? If I were the Baby Jeebus, I’d certainly be disappointed in your lack of enthusaism for defending me.”

      You’re a satanist and an admirer of Charles Manson and jew-loving faggot Aleister Crowley. Nobody here needs to justify themselves to you, Mike Jahn (still campaigning for Obama and supporting the Democrats?).

      “Isn’t any cultural move away from Christianity one of the Jew’s big goals? Should we worship Thor & Loki? How about the too pretentious for God Atheistic dead end?”

      That’s an accurate insight into this whole topic from a WN viewpoint, IMO. Certainly beats the crude, monotone braying of ‘jewsus’ and ‘Christard’ from 1488 types and the resident anti trolls.

      “Oh, so you have decided to come out and try to play with the big boys, huh McWeenie?”

      WTF?

      “Now you are attacking Tom Metzger again. Well, it doesn’t surprise me since the right wing conservative hate him, so why shouldn’t you?

      And I don’t know if Metzger believes in aliens building the pyramids, although I have known him for over 20 years and I’ve heard him say nothing of the sort.”

      Seriously, what are you? His wife or something? You attack New America for promoting Covington but you shill for Metzger like crazy. Give it a rest, I have nothing against the man I’m just bored of your patter.

    15. Tim McGreen Says:

      Tom, you may be surprised to know that in the early versions of the Gospels, Jesus had sexual intercourse with his male and female followers. But that part of the story was eventually omitted on orders from later, more conservative Church officials.

      Imagine that, Tom, a bisexual Jesus, a charismatic death cult-leader who gets it on with the boys and girls! What do you think of that, Tom? I guess Aleister Crowley would’ve fit right in with that crowd, eh, Tom?

      HahAHa ha HAHA hahaHA !!!!!
      (evil, maniacal laughter)

    16. Tum McBreen Says:

      I thought Diane Feinstein looked old. So she and Boxer were scamming the Gospels back then huh? Does “more conservative” mean “less jewish”? Remember this religious teacher went into the Jew temple and turned over their money tables. If jews were anything back then like they are now they NEVER forgive or forget. Saying he was a homo right after the dude died is well within their style and they probably did their fighting with their writing then as they do now.

    17. Susan Says:

      25,000+ children will die of starvation today, and you think a “god” will answer your prayers? Arrogant putz.

      ——————

      Praying is begging.