Unless one is a member of the NSM, I don't see any point in weighing in on this topic.

Jew propaganda is anti-White, not specifically anti-Nazi. A change of uniforms for the NSM would simply result in jewspapers and jewtv calling attention to it with their usual calm restraint: HATE GETS A MAKEOVER.

Unless one is a member of the NSM, I don't see any point in weighing in on this topic.

Jew propaganda is anti-White, not specifically anti-Nazi. A change of uniforms for the NSM would simply result in jewspapers and jewtv calling attention to it with their usual calm restraint: HATE GETS A MAKEOVER.

From the above, I will allow myself a tad of cynicism and assume that you are a member of the NSM, hence your reason for, "weighing in on this topic."

You are a prime example of the 30% that I referred to in my reply.

Let's put it this way. If the NSM is to lead the White movement, they will have to change their uniform -- into a 21st century non-Nazi one (like the Swedes' uniform) or even into jeans and white t-shirts or into no uniform at all. But whatever they decide to replace it with, they need to get themselves out of the Nazi garb. Or they will be leading us forward with their actions and, at the same time, holding us back with their jew-stigmatized outfit. That one-step forward one-step backward approach, it seems to me, will have a hard time generating effective and massive forward motion -- and effective and massive forward motion is what is desperately needed.

If that change is not made, the White movement with the NSM in the Nazi uniforms at the helm, will be operating under a needless self-imposed handicap -- it's far too easy a propaganda target for the jew media. In fact, I'll go farther. Their Nazi uniform alone could destroy a White movement's chances of ever getting off the ground in America -- because the White movement itself will be too successfully stigmatized by the jew-media as Nazis.

And so, NSM, you are doing the right things -- with the wrong appearance. And this is no small matter.

What was William Pierce's opinion on this subject? He was a genius. He was not usually wrong. And he was not wrong about this.

Personally, I like the idea of a sharp, modern, simple uniform. I think it will attract both young White men and young White women. But I also think it will be much easier for the NSM to change into a different uniform -- and remain a cohesive effective organization -- than into no uniform.

The NSM must think outside of their box on this one. A lot depends on them and on their decision on this matter.

Unless one is a member of the NSM, I don't see any point in weighing in on this topic.

The White race needs all the help it can get -- from all of its people. Often, someone who supports them but is outside the organization, looking in, can better put himself in the shoes of those who are not yet in the NSM but would like to be. It would be unwise for those of us who support NSM actions not to give our well-intended advice and unwise for the NSM to refuse to listen because we are not, or are not yet, members. This cause is vastly bigger and more important than the turf of any one organization.

Jew propaganda is anti-White, not specifically anti-Nazi. A change of uniforms for the NSM would simply result in jewspapers and jewtv calling attention to it with their usual calm restraint: HATE GETS A MAKEOVER.

The focus of the uniform change would not be the jew-media (who will always find ways to direct their psychological warfare against our people) but at our people themselves, for whom the Nazi symbology has been equated with evil. Reaching our own people will certainly be easier without the Nazi uniforms. There's no doubt about it.

From the above, I will allow myself a tad of cynicism and assume that you are a member of the NSM, hence your reason for, "weighing in on this topic."

No, actually I'm not a member of the NSM. Just someone who believes that the dues-paying membership of that very effective organization is in a better position to decide how they will present themselves than I am.

I'll allow myself a tad of cynicism and assume that you are exactly the type of do-nothing, contribute-nothing, "supporter" who is addressed at length by VonBluvens and Doc on the 5/1/06 VonBluvens show.

http://www.nsm88radio.com/

The focus of the uniform change would not be the jew-media (who will always find ways to direct their psychological warfare against our people) but at our people themselves, for whom the Nazi symbology has been equated with evil. Reaching our own people will certainly be easier without the Nazi uniforms. There's no doubt about it.

Brother, I understand what you're saying, and I have to respectfully disagree. Nazi symbols are equated with evil by lemmings because they have been programmed to think that way by the jew. It would not matter if the NSM changed its uniform--the jews would simply crank up the propaganda machine and announce the new "uniform of hate" to the masses, who would respond in their usual way: with fear and loathing. Meanwhile, those who are racially aware, and tempermentally suited for the NSM, will not be put off from joining, regardless of the uniform.

No, actually I'm not a member of the NSM. Just someone who believes that the dues-paying membership of that very effective organization is in a better position to decide how they will present themselves than I am.

I'll allow myself a tad of cynicism and assume that you are exactly the type of do-nothing, contribute-nothing, "supporter" who is addressed at length by VonBluvens and Doc on the 5/1/06 VonBluvens show.

http://www.nsm88radio.com/

Thats a really good common sense way to look at it all too. If the shoe was on the other foot, I hope I'd be adult enough to look at it the same way.

I've also noticed something that I'm wondering if others hadn't noticed around here too. It seems some people think they are due a lot of "Internet-White-Power-Points" (IWPP for short) for claiming to be above the whole NSM drive foward. Its like "oh nothing is more Nazi than saying Hilter wouldn't have liked the NSM...he would have liked my idea better." When you break it down, without the 3 page posts on how much you think you know about National Socialism, its childish.

Sometimes I think some of our detractors think somehow that we're marking the end to the era of Stormfront generation of White Nationalism, therefore, pushing them out of the spotlight for one reason or another. They're right. We are marking the end of the keyboard jockies and conference monkeys being the "activists" of the movement. At some point, someone was going to do that, people. The internet-Aryan-warriors of the Volk weren't built to last anyway. Now is a good time to ask yourself if you've been sitting on your hands for lack of anything better to do or lack of courage and strength of conviction. I can understand the not-having-anything-better-going-on part. I wasn't the first guy in the movement to run out there in the face of the jew wearing the shirt and armband. People were doing it long before I got on board. Now is really a time to ask yourself what you can do to help the movement.

Talking bad about the NSM because you think that it will make them go away is silly. Doing it in the name of the movement is every more silly. What do you think would happen if the NSM went away? Yep, Duke, his crowd or someone like them would just go right back to cashing checks and talking from behind the locked doors of confrence halls. Stormfront types would fill volumns worth of go-nowhere ideas, sightings of problems and tales of "how it will be when we get to power..." "Educational" groups would rise, splinter and fall as they tend to do. Some of you would be right at home back in that kind of movement. I don't see how anyone who lived through any ammount of time through that could ever want to go back "in the name of progress!"

Right now, win or lose, you all have the opportunity to see what we make of our sucess. Talking and yammering away doesn't hurt us. It only hurts "talker" organizations, since thats what they run on. If it could be said about us, true or false, its been said. What everyone can do is support us or choose not to. The future will tell where we go with this thing. Heck, some of the greatest men on earth with some of the greatest troops at their command have screwed things up. We're not perfect either. We might make mistakes too. Frankly, I'm glad to see things going in the direction their going in, not just because I'm an NSM member but because I'm white.

Brother, I understand what you're saying, and I have to respectfully disagree. Nazi symbols are equated with evil by lemmings because they have been programmed to think that way by the jew. It would not matter if the NSM changed its uniform--the jews would simply crank up the propaganda machine and announce the new "uniform of hate" to the masses, who would respond in their usual way: with fear and loathing. Meanwhile, those who are racially aware, and tempermentally suited for the NSM, will not be put off from joining, regardless of the uniform.

This is true as well.

Some punk on here was saying "wouldn't it have been dumb if the SA marched out in Viking gear..." or something to that effect. Jews have never been afraid of Vikings nor do they represent something like say, white revolution to most people (not to be confused with the defunct organization). Whats funny is that its a little known fact that once the German government did ban the uniform before the NS took power. They all marched out in white shirts and guess what, the jewish media still threw firey darts.

As far as the education of the masses, no we don't have channels blaring our message on tv and radio, 24/7. What we do have is will power. What we do have is countless shows of courage. What we do have is the support and loyalty of brave men who seek to win glory for their people. Thats work all the transitor tubes, LCDs, speakers and print you could ever stack into your home.

I can certainly agree with your senitments on this matter of uniforms and international recognition. I honestly think that copies of Nazi uniforms from the 30-40's and the "Seig Heiling" by the American patriots is something of a put-off for those that we, as Americans, would wish to woo over to our side of lucidity and truth. Having said that, I do not for a moment doubt the sincerity of those who do wear those uniforms nor their righteous passion for our cause.

Furthermore, I think that you will agree that even among the various and splintered groups here in the US, it is quite often impossible to obtain such a simple concensus as to whether it is either day or night: much less concerning uniforms. Hence, we are faced with a quandry that may easily or not so easily be resolved.

Yes, I am sure the Swedish style is effective and easily recognized by all Swedes. My personal opinion is that in America a universal uniform could be easily adapted by all pro-white movements when we are on the streets in manifestations or protests. And as always, the American Flag should be the unfurled banner of our movement in all parades and meets. By that, I mean large 5X8 foot flags: each man and woman carrying one. Once the lemming public begins to recognize that particular graphic image at all public meetings and parades, I think they would feel much more comfortable about approaching us for further information obout our cause.

Too often, I think we tend to preach to the choir and forget the true purpose of our mission. The purpose of all pro-white movements should be to attract all the new followers that we can in order to bolster our fight against the jews and their lackey puppets who have ursurped our white civilizations all over the world.

We make a small yet effective statements when we dialogue with our relatives, friends and neighbors. Yet, when we mass in front of the lemmings and detractors, should we portray ourselves in the exact image that they have been inculcated to believe to be the very epitome of evil?

We who read and post on these boards know that in these days and times for 300-400 WNers of any persuasion to assemble in one given area at any given time is unheard of.

How can that be? Do we care so little?

Striking off 30% as slackers, trolls, jew moles and LEA parasites looking for a piece of fresh meat, that leaves us with a known total of about 150,000 supposed White activists in America. If anyone has statistics to contradict my off-the-cuff guesstimate, please post them here.

Is it impossible for us to assemble at least 100,000 White Nationalists under one common flag and in one common uniform (or no uniform) at least once a year? Has the jew made us all so selfish and individualistic that we are willing to put our boot in the face of our brother over the common message that we must all carry and share, all because of a disagreement of uniforms?

If not, please tell the rest of the White Nationalists in Europe and other besieged areas of the world why we as Americans can not.

Let us not fall prey to the whims of fashion designers in the furtherance of our common cause.

We are all engaged in a deadly serious enterprise of which the outcome will decide the eternal destiny of our race. How can we be so foolish to compromise such a momentous task with such quibblings as to what uniform is appropriate?

I am sure that a uniform sea of 100,000 American Flags in any city, at any time, all carried by people with the same message will obscure any differences of dress that we may have.

If you're thinking about the value of the American patriot, just check out the news from yesterday.

the nsm uniform is so badd ass thjere is no reason to change it we will continue to be the largest NAZI PARTY IN AMERICA

:cheers:

the nsm uniform is so badd ass thjere is no reason to change it we will continue to be the largest NAZI PARTY IN AMERICA

:cheers:

And you'll continue to be an internet-heckler. Who cares?

The Jews will slander and wail about any group fighting for white rights, calling them Nazis. That's fine. The uniforms shouldn't change because they're stigmatized by Jews, they should change because they're stigmatized by whites.

If the Jewsmedia cried "HATE GETS A MAKEOVER" it wouldn't matter - what the Jews think about the NSM simply doesn't matter, never has. It's what the whites think about the NSM that matters.

The Jewsmedia tries to intimidate by slurring anyone as Nazis who advocate for white interests, and they're usually effective because most people are scared to death of being called Nazis or being associated with them. "Heritage, not hate" mewls the CCC and other lame organizations.

All those organizations are scared to death and that's why they shy away from Nazi imagery. The NSM isn't scared, that much is clear. But there are other reasons to not wear a Nazi uniform.

Seeing the old Nazi uniforms really does smack of childish fetishism and a longing for a past that is lost, regardless of whether the Jewsmedia cries about it or not. Dressing up in old uniforms of a foreign nation that lost a war is ridiculous on its face, regardless of the motives of those doing so.

Imagine if some group dressed up as British royal guards with the big black fuzzy hats and was trying to get itself taken seriously. What if a bunch of people dressed up in confederate soldier uniforms and was agitating for some political change? It'd be ridiculous, just as the old Nazi uniforms are now. "What clowns these guys are" thinks the common white.

These reasons are PRECISELY WHY the original Nazi party DIDN'T dress up in old uniforms from a previous age. They weren't wearing viking costumes or other stupid crap like that. They were wearing the most futuristic and stylish uniforms which existed back then, and people saw it and were taken in by the future Hitler sold them.

Just as then, today a New image for a New Century is needed.

Further thoughts:

The old Nazi uniforms and imagery itself reveals weakness and will make the womanly masses think so.

By leaning on the imagery of the Germans and their movement, it shows to the masses that the group can't even be original enough to create its own image. Does the NSM have to borrow imagery from a strong movement of the past because it cannot create its own strength here today?

In fact, I think that argument alone is reason enough for an American WN group to not use ANY recognizable flags from the past.

AmeriKwa is no more. It's lost and the political system it once had is irreparably broken. We will win this thing by creating an entirely new government and nation to further the interests of our people, and that will require new symbolism and imagery the likes of which people have yet to see.

The Jews will slander and wail about any group fighting for white rights, calling them Nazis. That's fine. The uniforms shouldn't change because they're stigmatized by Jews, they should change because they're stigmatized by whites.

If the Jewsmedia cried "HATE GETS A MAKEOVER" it wouldn't matter - what the Jews think about the NSM simply doesn't matter, never has. It's what the whites think about the NSM that matters.

The Jewsmedia tries to intimidate by slurring anyone as Nazis who advocate for white interests, and they're usually effective because most people are scared to death of being called Nazis or being associated with them. "Heritage, not hate" mewls the CCC and other lame organizations.

All those organizations are scared to death and that's why they shy away from Nazi imagery. The NSM isn't scared, that much is clear. But there are other reasons to not wear a Nazi uniform.

Seeing the old Nazi uniforms really does smack of childish fetishism and a longing for a past that is lost, regardless of whether the Jewsmedia cries about it or not. Dressing up in old uniforms of a foreign nation that lost a war is ridiculous on its face, regardless of the motives of those doing so.

Imagine if some group dressed up as British royal guards with the big black fuzzy hats and was trying to get itself taken seriously. What if a bunch of people dressed up in confederate soldier uniforms and was agitating for some political change? It'd be ridiculous, just as the old Nazi uniforms are now. "What clowns these guys are" thinks the common white.

These reasons are PRECISELY WHY the original Nazi party DIDN'T dress up in old uniforms from a previous age. They weren't wearing viking costumes or other stupid crap like that. They were wearing the most futuristic and stylish uniforms which existed back then, and people saw it and were taken in by the future Hitler sold them.

Just as then, today a New image for a New Century is needed.

Jews have never been afraid of Vikings or went to great lengths to smear them.

I respect what you are saying because you're saying it in an adult matter, not as a matter of the VNN "who can be the most Nazi" contest. What I have to do is ask you to come out with us sometime and see how people really act, not how one might assume they would. We're welcome pretty much everywhere and people stop us on the streets voicing their support for us. Normally, if someone denys us a place to eat or something like that, its because they are worried that the reds will come and start violence. They never accuse us of being the trouble makers. Women come up to have their pictures made with us and sometimes return with their entire families! Don't count the white people out yet. Plenty still know the score or can figure it out pretty quick once our boots are on their streets.

Walking down the street in a suit holding a plackard spells one thing to people: religious fruit/street preacher. Get a whole lot of them together and its about like Christians protesting the local porn store. Its just part of the scenary.

Its almost like a rock concert. We have a lot of people who are there to see us and a good many who are there to tell everyone else they are going to hell for just being there. I don't see us as having an image problem. My Gods, Gene Simmons, the jew, made millions of dollars and have millions of fans with every Christian group in the country after him and his usage of Satanic imagery. Give people something they like to see and they'll forget a lot of what they've been taught. They want to see someone standing up for them, standing up for themselves and like most folks, they want to see a fight. If it was NASCAR, you could say half of them were there hoping to see a wreck.

On top of all that, how does one explain our growth if we have a PR problem that needs addressing? We've actually had problems keeping up with membership packets for people who have signed up.

In anycase, we can all agree that the NSM is a great way to shake some of these tea-cups off the boat. Its high time the movement ditched them and we've got them storming off left and right.

The Jews will slander and wail about any group fighting for white rights, calling them Nazis. That's fine. The uniforms shouldn't change because they're stigmatized by Jews, they should change because they're stigmatized by whites.

If the Jewsmedia cried "HATE GETS A MAKEOVER" it wouldn't matter - what the Jews think about the NSM simply doesn't matter, never has. It's what the whites think about the NSM that matters.

The Jewsmedia tries to intimidate by slurring anyone as Nazis who advocate for white interests, and they're usually effective because most people are scared to death of being called Nazis or being associated with them. "Heritage, not hate" mewls the CCC and other lame organizations.

All those organizations are scared to death and that's why they shy away from Nazi imagery. The NSM isn't scared, that much is clear. But there are other reasons to not wear a Nazi uniform.

Seeing the old Nazi uniforms really does smack of childish fetishism and a longing for a past that is lost, regardless of whether the Jewsmedia cries about it or not. Dressing up in old uniforms of a foreign nation that lost a war is ridiculous on its face, regardless of the motives of those doing so.

Imagine if some group dressed up as British royal guards with the big black fuzzy hats and was trying to get itself taken seriously. What if a bunch of people dressed up in confederate soldier uniforms and was agitating for some political change? It'd be ridiculous, just as the old Nazi uniforms are now. "What clowns these guys are" thinks the common white.

These reasons are PRECISELY WHY the original Nazi party DIDN'T dress up in old uniforms from a previous age. They weren't wearing viking costumes or other stupid crap like that. They were wearing the most futuristic and stylish uniforms which existed back then, and people saw it and were taken in by the future Hitler sold them.

Just as then, today a New image for a New Century is needed.

Yes. We're eye to eye on this one, Fenrir.