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Reading though all this….I can’t think of anything I want to add at this point.

in reply to Hoosier:

I think we are engaged in a burial for “Movement Past,” and are working on the Final Requiem.

I’ve pretty much had it with being rational with the irrational, and I want to bury these old losers as soon as possible.

If that is how this thread ends up, so much the better.

I have come to the conclusion – and no one has rebutted it – that Pierce simply captured lightning in a jar with Kevin Alfred Strom, and Strom’s American Dissident Voices broadcasts were the only thing remotely “National” about the National Alliance.

I think this thread is important, for I am finally beginning to articulate the hypothesis concerning Briseis’ concerns – WHY things are much worse than we let on, and WHAT we can do about it.

I think a lot of the gratuitous attacks on Kevin Alfred Strom are based on…jealousy, and the idea that he might begin to fulfill his unique Heritage for unique Destiny of the RACE.

The Soft, Safe, Glorious Past That Never Was is where so much of “Movement Past” went through the motions of RACIAL Activism, but, somehow, they resemble the motions of a hamster on his wheel – lots of activity, but NO productivity.

THAT might be the epitaph of Pierce, and “Movement Past”:

“Activity, Without Productivity.”

I’ll have more to say directly.

Thanks for the comments, and the support!

New America

An Idea Whose Time Is HERE

in reply to Vaultner:

you wrote:

*snip*
“The problem is, the White Nationalist “Movement” consisted of nothing BUT “splinter groups,” who could only afford enough to buy barbecue and beer – for themselves.”
Thank you; I’ll take that as a partial agreement on too many splinter groups being a bad thing.

in reply:
In fact, the “splinter groups” are insignificant in size, and number.

Just as well, considering what happens in more than one fool is in a room at a time!

you wrote:

I think the part of the “Movement” that is dead is the National Alliance. It died with Pierce, look at the mess that ensued with the death of Butler. Which always amazed me because I think Pastor Wickstrom is capable of carrying on in his absence.
Earlier in my posts I said that you expected too much from the leaders as well as the followers. We should be able to, but obviously that’s not the case.

in reply:
If the “Leaders” can not make plans for the continuity of the organization in their absence, it’s not really an “organization,” in any meaningful sense of the term.

It’s a cult – in the case of the National Alliance, the Cult of One Man, William Luther Pierce.

Pierce dies, cult withers away.

you wrote:

When a leader dies the followers obviously look to new leadership, either appointed or elected. If there is no clear second all agreed to, then it will fail. If the second is not up to the task & has not defined his third again it will fail. Enough said.

in reply:
Funny how Pierce never made any plans for his death, or even groomed someone to fulfill Leadership Duties in his absence.

Think there’s a reason for that?

So do I, and it is not at all flattering to Pierce.

you wrote:

We are & have been expecting a grass roots movement that unfortunately can’t succeed, through more than one leadership role.

in reply:
I suspect there is a bit more to it than that, and I’ll deal with that at the end, in the context of Harold Covington’s Northwest Republic.

you wrote:

The success of Hitler came from the Freecorps. Unemployed military men, cast out after WWI. Not people who can usually still manage to eak out a living. Germany was in total ruins, 80% of their GNP was to go for reparations to the Allies. They had nothing & they were often starving. Hitler gave them hope when they had none, & he was not the only Nationalist leader. There were others that for the most part were either made to shut up or were totally destroyed.

in reply:
I suspect there was more to it than that, but an economic collapse is always the fomenting event for revolutionary moments.

you wrote:

Germany had become a Militarized Society in the 1890’s. They understood chains of command & orders. Americans have little or no comprehension of this. Some can understand the need for change & a lack of niggers, faggots, jews, criminals & the rest. But of those fewer can appreciate the Swastikas & the idea of a dictatorship over a Democratic Republic.

in reply:
I suspect that ninety percent of our nominal RACIAL kin spend more time watching “Oprah,” and “Sportsworld,” than dealing concretely with any issue.

Just as well.

you wrote:

For me I think it should be a short-term solution until the problems are solved. All of the tools necessary were given to us by the Founding Fathers. It has just been hijacked by the jew.

in reply:
The American Revolution of 1776 – 1791 was displaced by the American Revolution of 1860 – 1876, which was displaced by the American Revolution of 1933, which was displaced by the American Revolution of 1968.

The Founding Fathers were not bound to an archaic model of governance, based on the needs of an earlier place and time.

Thus, men who met to amend the Articles of Confederation ended up forming a new nation – the Declaration of Independence was simply the formative event leading to the birth certificate of the new nation, the Constitution, and the Bill of Rights.

These political events reflected economic changes that has finally crystallized.

There are so many changes in play right now I can not define any but the most obvious – however, certain trends seem obvious.

you wrote:

The best final outcome for America is to return the Constitution to its original intent & add that one little line – For White Europeans only.

in reply:
No.

See above.

We MUST do better.

you wrote:

We are I think, in the eye of the storm just before the rest of America wakes up to the reality of their fate of rampant crime, ten dollar a gallon gas, exhausted immigration, the furtherance of diversity, etc., etc., & ultimately the next depression. All brought on by the jew. When & if it collapses is when the opportunity is greatest, but not if there are too many chiefs & not enough Indians.

in reply:
“For lack of a Vision, the people perish.”

All of the chiefs, and all of the Indians, work to no avail, if they are all heading in the wrong direction.

One direction – the Past – leads directly to Hillsboro, and stops there.

Another direction – the Future – leads to a Brighter, Whiter America Reborn in a Northwest Republic, where the line suddenly goes from horizontal to vertical, and from Kalispell “To The Stars.”

New America

An Idea Whose Time Is HERE

I think the comments on Kevin Strom aren’t based on jealousy, New America. They’re based on the fact that he pleaded guilty to possession of child pornography. If he really did it, then he crossed a line that cannot be crossed. After that, there’s no coming back to this “movement,” “non-movement,” three ring circus, whatever you want to call it, or whatever it may become in the future. That’s my line in the sand. There’s no need to answer me here, NA, but I ask you consider what I am saying.

But if all the evidence was planted, and his confession is based on torture or some sort of threat of being thrown in a cage with 20 niggers until he signed on the dotted line, Then this is real fucking tragedy. No, either way, it’s a tragedy.

The “movement” as it stands today seems to be like a cult.
I know all about cults, oh yes, yes I do. Back in 1989 I decided to do something about a drinking problem I had developed, so I joined an organization called Alcoholics Anonymous.

Alcoholics Anonymous turned out to be a cult, or “cult-lite” as it’s sometimes refered to by its critics. It was a incomprehensible conflicting mess, and all people did was savage each other. And those damn stupid meetings, with the same people saying the same boring things over and over, acting like they were happy, but really miserable. I also remember the endless negativity.

Finally, despite their dire warnings about my imminent decent into alcoholic madness or death, I had enough of it all, and left. After I left, I went through a period of extreme disorentation, but once I came back to my senses, I was able to resolve my drinking problem completely, on my own, starting with an idea that occured to me out of the blue. A whole shit load of complexity merged into a single strand. Then with a couple books I found at the library and being resourceful, I had the tools I needed. But in order to get past my problem, I had to find that whole new point of view, that was completely different than what I had been exposed to in treatment and AA groups. Compared to the AA way, it was so easy it was almost boring.

Blah Blah, enough about me. Anyway, AA has about a 5-10% success rate. Most people get sick of it and leave. The demands and expectations become TOO FUCKING HARD, too slow, too unreasonable, and most people just give up.

I’d say the movement, as it stands now, has about the same chances of success as AA does – 5-10%, if even that. It’s not going to change either. Another thing about cults is, they will drive the members to the point of madness. Sincere people will be driven almost insane. Insincere exploiters will become more evil but the evil is directed at the other members. The “movement” seems to be eating it’s members.

I don’t know, I’m speculating, maybe Kevin and Elisha Strom got caught in the cult atmosphere, and it ended up bringing out the very worst in them. Harold Covington, it seems, got caught up in the same thing.

It seems like a whole new viewpoint needs to be adopted to the “movement” – mimicking my own experience with AA and drinking.
You may very be right about his books, New America. The right view point, the right “box” very well may be embedded in his books. I’m reading “A Distant Thunder” right now, and you were right about pages 138-152. It’s the best synopsis of economic issues I’ve read yet.

Best Wishes.

in reply to Hoosier:

you wrote:

I think the comments on Kevin Strom aren’t based on jealousy, New America. They’re based on the fact that he pleaded guilty to possession of child pornography. If he really did it, then he crossed a line that cannot be crossed. After that, there’s no coming back to this “movement,” “non-movement,” three ring circus, whatever you want to call it, or whatever it may become in the future. That’s my line in the sand. There’s no need to answer me here, NA, but I ask you consider what I am saying.

in reply:
I like the “cult/AA” metaphor, and it has stronger relevance than many might think.

And, Kevin Alfred Strom plead to “possession” of recovered file fragments that were defined as child pornography.

There were many opportunities for others to place those on his hard drive, as no WINDOWS pc is secure.

I put the issue of “jealousy” in the context that he Created – there’s that unique Talent only our RACE possesses – wrote, edited, and broadcast the one thing that actually attracted people to White Nationalism, and that was American Dissident Voices.

He did it before, and he can do something not unlike it, again.

Indeed, that is my fond hope…

you wrote:

But if all the evidence was planted, and his confession is based on torture or some sort of threat of being thrown in a cage with 20 niggers until he signed on the dotted line, Then this is real fucking tragedy. No, either way, it’s a tragedy.

in reply:
Would he DARE go to trial, when the chance of defeat would be, literally, a death sentence?

No.

You take the deal, you get your life back. It might not be your OLD life, but it’s yours.

You turn the deal down, you lose your life in a torturous Hell on Earth, knowing that your death is the one thing so many of the inmates wish to see happen.

Take the deal.

you wrote:

The “movement” as it stands today seems to be like a cult.

in reply:
That’s been my sense for some time.

How it became that way is one issue; what can be done about it, is another issue altogether.

More on that directly.

you wrote:

I know all about cults, oh yes, yes I do. Back in 1989 I decided to do something about a drinking problem I had developed, so I joined an organization called Alcoholics Anonymous.

in reply:
Ah, yes, another friend of William W., “Big Book,” and all, including the “One and Only One True Way.”

I almost married an alcoholic…

I thought I could “save her” from alcoholism, when she finally revealed it to me.

Cost me two years of my life…

Never again.

I was forced to learn about alcoholism, as a “disease process,” and Alcoholics Anonymous, as a cult, fairly quickly.

you wrote:

Alcoholics Anonymous turned out to be a cult, or “cult-lite” as it’s sometimes refered to by its critics. It was a incomprehensible conflicting mess, and all people did was savage each other. And those damn stupid meetings, with the same people saying the same boring things over and over, acting like they were happy, but really miserable. I also remember the endless negativity.

in reply:
DAMN, but doesn’t that remind you of so much of what White Nationalism has become?

All manner of bitching, carping, and complaining, and NO WAY UP AND OUT of the situation?

It’s like we are all stuck in the functional equivalent of a sandbox, waiting for Someone to tell us to put away the toys, we have real work to do.

That “Someone” can ONLY be US, taking the personal responsibility to “BE WHAT WE WANT THE WORLD TO BECOME.”

And, if you want to see the “Movement” as a Sandbox, just look at the various bulletin boards…

you wrote:

Finally, despite their dire warnings about my imminent decent into alcoholic madness or death, I had enough of it all, and left. After I left, I went through a period of extreme disorentation, but once I came back to my senses, I was able to resolve my drinking problem completely, on my own, starting with an idea that occured to me out of the blue. A whole shit load of complexity merged into a single strand. Then with a couple books I found at the library and being resourceful, I had the tools I needed. But in order to get past my problem, I had to find that whole new point of view, that was completely different than what I had been exposed to in treatment and AA groups. Compared to the AA way, it was so easy it was almost boring.

in reply:
That’s what White Nationalism was to me, following my reading of Harold Covington’s books.

Suddenly, ALL RACIAL ISSUES had the proper Analytical Framework, and the proper RACIAL Context.

Suddenly, IT ALL MADE SENSE.

All Covington wants us to do is what Adults do, is what Jefferson and Hamilton did, what Edison and Ford did, what Brigham Young did, what Peter Drucker did:

See everything in a new Light, from an Adult perspective, away from the Sandbox.

This is where Adult Responsibility – the ethical foundation of Adult Power – is found.

The “Movement” is like the Taggart Comet, at the end of “Atlas Shrigged”; slowly dying, alone on the prairie.

The Best have moved to Galt’s Gulch, leaving the Rest, behind, in the horrific Sandbox America has become, and will become even more, in the very near future.

you wrote:

Blah Blah, enough about me. Anyway, AA has about a 5-10% success rate. Most people get sick of it and leave. The demands and expectations become TOO FUCKING HARD, too slow, too unreasonable, and most people just give up.

in reply:
It’s “TOO FUCKING HARD” because it relies on a magic formula that only “works” – and I am using that term loosely – about 5-10% of the time.

There is NO VARIATION from the magic formula – true proof of a Cult.

you wrote:

I’d say the movement, as it stands now, has about the same chances of success as AA does – 5-10%, if even that. It’s not going to change either. Another thing about cults is, they will drive the members to the point of madness. Sincere people will be driven almost insane. Insincere exploiters will become more evil but the evil is directed at the other members. The “movement” seems to be eating it’s members.

in reply:
The “Movement” simply can not answer the first question of a successful political organization – “Why Should I Join You?”

So, the “Movement” stays back in the Sandbox, waiting for “Dad” to come back and magically transform them into teh better people they always suspected they were.

Too bad “Dad” left town some time ago, to be with other, more productive, “Adults.”

you wrote:

I don’t know, I’m speculating, maybe Kevin and Elisha Strom got caught in the cult atmosphere, and it ended up bringing out the very worst in them. Harold Covington, it seems, got caught up in the same thing.

in reply:
Covington saw it coming, and rejected the “Cult” model as simply going Nowhere – literally, Nowhere.

Sort of like White Nationalism as currently practiced, isn’t it?

you wrote:

It seems like a whole new viewpoint needs to be adopted to the “movement” – mimicking my own experience with AA and drinking.

in reply:
I could not agree more.

The Adult needs to return; however, he is already here, within us, waiting for us to pay attention to him, as he hearkens us back to our RACIAL Greatness.

THAT is the Problem, and THAT is the Insurmountable Opportunity.

you wrote:

You may very be right about his books, New America. The right view point, the right “box” very well may be embedded in his books. I’m reading “A Distant Thunder” right now, and you were right about pages 138-152. It’s the best synopsis of economic issues I’ve read yet.

Best Wishes.

in reply:
A New Way of Thinking is required for us to Create our way out of the Sandbox that our RACIAL Enemies have placed for us.

The painful answer – “There Is No ‘Movement.'”

There never really was.

And so many people who went looking for it, paid a horrific price for the traps laid in the Form of the “Movement.”

The Answer Is Within – simple as that.

Finding it is the true Work before us.

Again, I use the example of Yankee Jim, who COULD have faced his failed marriage, who COULD have realized it was not Going To Work, and who COULD be playing in a hotel bar in Kalispell, Montana, playing the records on “Oldies Night.”

And, again, that’s why my focus on Kevin Alfred Strom recurs, because I see his adult life as being, in microcosm, the White Nationalist “Movement.”

Kevin Alfred Strom has nothing, and nothing to lose.

He could – and should – Start Where He Is, unburdened by the idea that “Daddy” is coming back to Tell Us What To Do.

So should we all…

While we can.

Thanks for the “cult” metaphor, and the example of AA.

DAMN, but it rings true!

New America

An Idea Whose Time Is HERE

Socrates Says:
1 May, 2008 at 4:24 pm

—
Will Williams:

Here it is:
White Zion, Part 1: http://www.natall.com/pub/2002/113002.txt

Part 2: http://www.natall.com/pub/2002/120702.txt
—

Thanks, Socrates. I’ve saved them and can pass them on without sending folks to Erich Gliebe and his disreputable rump Alliance.

I just read Part 1, while pondering Ms. New Amerikwa’s ridiculous claims here that Dr. Pierce planned the NA to fail upon his death. Twenty-eight years ago, before he made the move to WV (and three months before Robert Mathews was Holocausted® by JOG), Dr. Pierce spoke these words:

“I’ll briefly review our general
considerations. We’ve needed a way to make what we’re building
independent of any one person. We have needed to tie it to a living,
growing community which embodies our values and our goals. If the whole
community truly does that, if it is composed of the best of our people,
if it is large enough and has enough resources to sustain itself, then
it should be able to survive the loss of any one person and continue
working toward our goals. If our goal were to get a candidate elected
president in 1988, then survivability would not be an urgent
consideration and we would be foolish to waste much time on it. But, as
a matter of fact, our goal lies far beyond 1988.

I’ve been working to build the Alliance since 1970, and I’m now 50 years
old. It becomes increasingly important to take steps to insure that the
work of the Alliance goes on without interruption in case something
happens to me. Even if I were immortal, however, and could remain at the
helm indefinitely, we would still have a survivability problem…”
—

So, kinsmen, believe who you may, the anonymous promoter of a convicted, lying fraud, who defames Dr. Pierce in his grave, or Dr. Pierce, speaking to us, himself? The audio version is even better.

Ms. New Amerikwa also criticizes WLP for not starting a political party. She doesn’t get it that the National Alliance was a movement with long term goals, from its inception, not a transitory political party.

She should be tied to a chair, put under a bright light, and forced to listen to a loud loop of this for about 72 hours straight, or until she breaks: “We’ve needed a way to make what we’re building
independent of any one person…It becomes increasingly important to take steps to insure that the work of the Alliance goes on without interruption in case something happens to me.”

Kevin Strom, among countless other contributions to the cause, is responsible for giving us this White Zion ADV series. His narrative in this transcript is part of our true movement history and is valued highest by the best historian as primary source material — KAS’s “lusting in his heart,” notwithstanding. History will be kind to Mr. Kevin Alfred Strom……………..if we prevail. Losers don’t write the histories.

Enough has been said here by me. I’ll just remind the reader, and Socrates, especially, that in a healthy movement “free speech” is not granted to subversives, especially anonymous ones — That soon proves to unnecessarily demoralize the more seriously committed comrades — and that lies, calculated to subvert, left unrefuted, tend to become the truth. “Perception is everything” was once Defendant Covington’s motto — no kidding. How does that “by way of deception…” code square with Dr. Pierce’s vow to always tell our people the hard truths they need, but which may make them extremely uncomfortable?

IT AIN’T OVER ‘TIL IT’Z OVER. . .

Will Williams said:
On “New America”
“She should be tied to a chair, put under a bright light, and forced to listen to a loud loop of this for about 72 hours straight, or until she breaks: “We’ve needed a way to make what we’re building
independent of any one person…It becomes increasingly important to take steps to insure that the work of the Alliance goes on without interruption in case something happens to me.”

LOL HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA!

That’s excellent, well said.

“IT AIN’T OVER ‘TIL IT’Z OVER. . .”

I was talking about this thread, fuckbrain.

in reply to Hoosier (in a few days!):

I think we have it.

I have argued that accepting White Nationalism is not unlike a process of religious conversion; the Quickening, a moment where the world seems to SHIFT in response to a new shift in your Consciousness, followed by the Awakening, a gradual, life-long endeavor into the functional equivalent of a new life.

The cult is simply a minor Aspect of the religious Impulse that misfires, and NEVER goes beyond The One Man.

For it to be a religion, it must bnd the Consciousness BACK to a premortal state of affairs, a Realm of the Gods, and the temporal manifestation of A Golden Age, when Men followed The Will Of The Gods.

Of ALL religions, only Christianity tries to bind the Consciousness of Man FORWARD, AND has the critical element seen in it’s spiritual forbearer, Zoroastrianism – We have our part to do in the fulfillment of God;s Plan for us, individually, and Mankind, collectively.

To do this, Christianity MUST be the vehicle that bears the Creator’s unique Gift – Creativity.

Institutionalization of Christianity, in turn, affects the religion by crystallizing it, and limiting it’s power of Creative Transformation.

The Clt does not make it even that far.

It consists of one man’s Vision, in one place, at one time.

White Nationalism is basically stuck at the Cult level, with carious Cultists arguing which one follows the True Leader – Rockwell, Duke, Pierce, whoever.

Covington has succeeded by providing the functional equivalent of a religious framework – an entire Universe ready for the only RACE that can transform it into what it COULD, and SHOULD, Become.

Kevin Alfred Strom, freed from the follies of Movement Past, has no shortage of opportunities before him.

Let’s hope he rises to the occasion, as I know he will.

New America

An Idea Whose Time Is HERE