Well acording to Alex he has had many more hits since he posted his porn. I'm willing to bet those extra hits were from Stormfronters and other WN forums who heard "VNN has gone porno".

Well according to Shaun Walker the National Alliance is the number 1 organization working for the future of white people. What the hell would it matter? The point remains that this is not going to "enrage" whites to racialism as some seem to think it would. Therefore it is not good propaganda. If anything it is worse.

That is a major problem. The collective "we" have far too many side issues which divide us.

No other race has that problem. Niggers know they are niggers, deep down. Spics? It's all about La Raza, vatto! Gooks? The asiatics are above board racist from their governments on down. Jews? Most clannish race to ever exist.

We Whites, OTOH, at best identify ourselves as Irish, or German, etc. Ask the average White guy or gal on the street to describe themselves. See what they list, in what order.

That's the key to effective propaganda.

Was/is the porn thing effective propaganda? I have no idea. I don't know how we would measure something like that at any rate.

The media has already successfully linked Hitler with 'Anti-Semitism' in the lemming mind so the very second we launch into attacks on the Jew, the lemming will say, "But that's what Hitler said and look what happened!"

We are forced into the position of trying to prove that Hitler wasn't "crazy" and that he was right about the Jews.

You have to talk with lemmings a lot to see how the cycle works

1. Individual WN names the Jew
2. Lemming says, "But that's what Hitler said and he was a madman!"
3. WN says, "But you don't understand..."
4. Lemming says, "6 million innocent Jews killed by a tyrant! Don't you know history?"

The point is that the media has turned the lemmings into these trained circus animals and they always act according to how they've been programmed. I'm not sure as a WN how you get around that obstacle. The real problem is that lemmings still trust media as an authority figure and don't view it with the same hostility that we do.

For example, a guy on Stormfront a few months ago was saying that he had converted a lot of his friends and family to WN and he lost all of them when ABC ran that feature story on Prussian Blue. In other words, "converted" WNs sat down and watched a JEW TV network, Jew produced, negative hit piece against Whites and decided that "TV is right, I've gone too far!!!"

I'm sick and tired of that kind of absurd behavior, you are NOT a WN nor are you capable of being a WN if you are still manipulated by Jew media. We will not gain any "converts" until Whites instinctively look upon mass media with total disgust! I still get into arguments with my family over this but you have to be 100% clear, TV media is JEW GARBAGE and therefore unacceptable as a source of authority.

If the lemmings rejected Jew media entirely they would no longer throw up these brick walls when discussing: Hitler, Jews, race, etc...

Good luck to you and the half dozen or so teenage perv methheads you're able to attract with your new nigger porn marketing strategy. I'm sure it will be the "vanguard" of White Nationalism. "Adult males" indeed. You're suicidal stubbornness has run off all the adult males that used to support this place.

All the kikes at the SPLC and ADL combined couldn't have fucked over VNN so much as this stupid bullshit. Congratulations.

I'm surprised at you, John. First of all, it was ONE photo...ONE. How could you get so worked up over that to abandon VNN? You've always been one of the best posters here so I can't believe you'd throw it all away and for what? Alex Linder has a vision and he is a creative artist. I hate to say it but this has turned into a Liberal vs. Conservative issue. To phrase it in a musical context that everyone can understand: it is like Alex has turned up the amplifiers and he's growing his hair long while the crewcut bunch wants to get away from him to go home and watch an episode of Bonanza

Well John you are not wanted around here anyhow. Take your provincial, "Aunt Bee" Baptist sensibilities and get your ass over to Stormfront you cackling old hen! Make way for the new breed of white nationalists!

All of the cussing on VNN was never exactly old-fashioned, was it?

Look there is no point arguing with Alex anymore, or anyone else on here. VNN has fully descended into the realm of fantasy, and there is no point trying to save it. Those of us who tried to preserve the NA wasted hundreds of hours collectively, and thousands of dollars as well,trying to prop up a dead horse. So fuck it- let VNN die. It's just a forum. Who are we to disturb the sycophants and nutjobs reassuring each other about chemtrails and how if they just NAME THE JEW enough times White America will spontaneously wake up somehow and suddenly reject that which they currently eat up like hot-cakes(porn, crude humor, hip-hop, multiracialism, drugs, etc.). I'm starting to think that 4chan /b/ is more relevant to racialism than this. At least there white people are racist without peer pressure and the endorsement of the board itself. Oh yeah, that and it's actually FUNNY.

VNN, Stormfront, and all the "White Power" forums can fuck themselves for all I care- show me one remotely successful political movement in the world that has as many forums dedicated to it as WNism.

Why do you always have to grandstand like this? I'm starting to think that you are just one of these big complainers who does it to be noticed.

No one has the perfect ideology or methods in your eyes. Perhaps the hero worship of Mao has rotted your brain?

I was SO in pornos. How dare you defame my character!

Does the state of VNN in the last few days remind anyone else of the golden age of the NHL? Fights all over the ice....:box:

OttoRemer, you're quickly becoming one of my favorite posters. I was just reading a thread at OD, for the first time in a couple of years. I saw your points sail right past the polios who, if anything, have regressed (even further!). It's a whole lot more disgusting than a porno-jew poster.

I'm watching the headless kwans squawking about how things like "illegal immigration", faggot-encouragement, etc. are going to be the final straw. Many decades ago I realized that American men who would accept racial integration with nothing more than a grumble would eventually accept ANYTHING! I can see the day when the goddamned jews become desperate for something new to cram down white throats. Oy, the Moishe race may die of boredom!

It's a very frustrating time.

OttoRemer, you're quickly becoming one of my favorite posters. I was just reading a thread at OD, for the first time in a couple of years. I saw your points sail right past the polios who, if anything, have regressed (even further!). It's a whole lot more disgusting than a porno-jew poster.

I'm watching the headless kwans squawking about how things like "illegal immigration", faggot-encouragement, etc. are going to be the final straw. Many decades ago I realized that American men who would accept racial integration with nothing more than a grumble would eventually accept ANYTHING! I can see the day when the goddamned jews become desperate for something new to cram down white throats. Oy, the Moishe race may die of boredom!

It's a very frustrating time.

Yes, you are right. No single issue is going to motivate the lemmings to fight back if they've already accepted the lazy mindset of "tolerance". WN is always running into a brick wall with the American people because the vast majority likes certain aspects of "Diversity". When trying to awaken Whites to WN I'm amazed by how many of them give me the "Oh I have a Black friend" or "My sister's husband is Jewish" stuff, and if that isn't bad enough they always fall back on the "But I'm 1/16 Native American!" SO WHAT?

AWWW come on, guys. Everybody loves a split. 31 flavors.

Good to see a good man go. Hard to find a good place to go.

I was going to post something really abstract and entertaining but I just saw this thing on the front page about a dog got eaten? The nigger was on pcp lol that's the usual. That "large animal tranquilizer" sure makes the niggers go nuts. Remember rapper "big lurch" who ate the whore's lungs? He ran naked too. Watch out for those dust-smokin niggers. "Sherm" lol was that named after General Sherman? No telling.

The media has already successfully linked Hitler with 'Anti-Semitism' in the lemming mind so the very second we launch into attacks on the Jew, the lemming will say, "But that's what Hitler said and look what happened!"

We are forced into the position of trying to prove that Hitler wasn't "crazy" and that he was right about the Jews.

You have to talk with lemmings a lot to see how the cycle works

1. Individual WN names the Jew
2. Lemming says, "But that's what Hitler said and he was a madman!"
3. WN says, "But you don't understand..."
4. Lemming says, "6 million innocent Jews killed by a tyrant! Don't you know history?"

The point is that the media has turned the lemmings into these trained circus animals and they always act according to how they've been programmed. I'm not sure as a WN how you get around that obstacle. The real problem is that lemmings still trust media as an authority figure and don't view it with the same hostility that we do.

For example, a guy on Stormfront a few months ago was saying that he had converted a lot of his friends and family to WN and he lost all of them when ABC ran that feature story on Prussian Blue. In other words, "converted" WNs sat down and watched a JEW TV network, Jew produced, negative hit piece against Whites and decided that "TV is right, I've gone too far!!!"

Of course he had not actually "converted" anyone. His friends and family were probably just humoring him. In my experience, unless you yourself make an active effort to learn and figure things out for yourself, you will not break free of Jew Media Conditioning. You will easily knuckle under to any kind of social pressure at all - even if the only "pressure" is from the TV! TV is an Authority Figure. Some random friend or relative who is spouting off about race and trying to convert you to WN is not an Authority Figure. After all, your friends and family know you and your foibles and weaknesses. They aren't going to take you seriously when everyone/everything else in their lives that they have been taught to respect says that you are wrong.

Media conditioning is hard to unlearn. I'm forever frustrated with "conservative" friends who, for instance, whinge and moan all the time about the "liberal media" but yet who instantly believe this very same media when it tells them what they want to hear - ie, about the "war on terror" or whatever. They can't even follow their own inclinations to doubt the media consistently. When I was a newbie, learning things, 15-20 years ago, I also would constantly backslide. I'd read some revisionist history, and be convinced]
I'm sick and tired of that kind of absurd behavior, you are NOT a WN nor are you capable of being a WN if you are still manipulated by Jew media. We will not gain any "converts" until Whites instinctively look upon mass media with total disgust! I still get into arguments with my family over this but you have to be 100% clear, TV media is JEW GARBAGE and therefore unacceptable as a source of authority.

If the lemmings rejected Jew media entirely they would no longer throw up these brick walls when discussing: Hitler, Jews, race, etc...

The lemmings have always been lemmings, though. They have always Obeyed Authority, Done As They Were Told, Cleaned Their Rooms, Brushed Their Teeth, etc. Whether it be Daddy or Big Brother made no difference; the lemmings could always be relied upon to believe the lies those in power told them, do more or less as they were taught to do, and still cling to the belief that they could "think for themselves" and that they were "free and independent" and living in "the freest country on Earth". So once Jew media became the new Authority, the lemmings fell right into line. This should shock and suprise no one.

Just look at Stormfront, fer Xrst's sake! The supposedly premier White Nationalist website, and its forums are flooded with clueless lemmings who don't even know the basic history we were taught in school, much less the more accurate revisionist history we learned on our own by reading such sources as IHR, NA/NV, Instauration, etc. And this mess is controlled by "moderators" like JJT who are equally as ignorant. We are failing to educate our newbies, and it shows. I mean, if we can't educate people who want to be WN, who are willing to post on a WN forum, then all hope is lost. The people posting on SF are not typical lemmings; they have at least made the first baby step in the right direction, but there's no one there providing the indoctrination and education that used to exist, in the pre-internet era. The information is easier to find; gone are the days when a newbie had to hunt for months or years to find the right addresses to PO Boxes to find access to "forbidden" knowledge. The knowledge is there at our fingertips, but we aren't pointing people in the right direction and applying the kinds of social pressures needed to encourage them to learn - partly because you can't really apply social pressure on an internet forum, partly because we still lack real communities where such social pressure would be effective.

Hell, just the other day I stumbled on a SF thread where the lemmings were gushing about how Michael Savage - Michael Savage! - was such a wonderful guy, why, sure, he's a Jew but he says "antisemitic" things sometimes and he's on the "right" side of white issues, I kid you not. I nearly burst my gut laughing. This kind of invincible naivete cannot be cured in a few days or weeks, but requires years of effort to unlearn the conditioning we have been programmed with, and unless the lemming in question is willing to make the effort, it won't happen.

I don't know about the wisdom of Alex's tactics. He may be right that the porn thing is the right tactic to shock and motivate the 20-somethings. Maybe. But there is more than one "right" tactic and more than one target audience out there.

Of course he had not actually "converted" anyone. His friends and family were probably just humoring him. In my experience, unless you yourself make an active effort to learn and figure things out for yourself, you will not break free of Jew Media Conditioning. You will easily knuckle under to any kind of social pressure at all - even if the only "pressure" is from the TV! TV is an Authority Figure. Some random friend or relative who is spouting off about race and trying to convert you to WN is not an Authority Figure. After all, your friends and family know you and your foibles and weaknesses. They aren't going to take you seriously when everyone/everything else in their lives that they have been taught to respect says that you are wrong.

Media conditioning is hard to unlearn. I'm forever frustrated with "conservative" friends who, for instance, whinge and moan all the time about the "liberal media" but yet who instantly believe this very same media when it tells them what they want to hear - ie, about the "war on terror" or whatever. They can't even follow their own inclinations to doubt the media consistently. When I was a newbie, learning things, 15-20 years ago, I also would constantly backslide. I'd read some revisionist history, and be convinced]want to be WN, who are willing to post on a WN forum, then all hope is lost. The people posting on SF are not typical lemmings; they have at least made the first baby step in the right direction, but there's no one there providing the indoctrination and education that used to exist, in the pre-internet era. The information is easier to find; gone are the days when a newbie had to hunt for months or years to find the right addresses to PO Boxes to find access to "forbidden" knowledge. The knowledge is there at our fingertips, but we aren't pointing people in the right direction and applying the kinds of social pressures needed to encourage them to learn - partly because you can't really apply social pressure on an internet forum, partly because we still lack real communities where such social pressure would be effective.

Hell, just the other day I stumbled on a SF thread where the lemmings were gushing about how Michael Savage - Michael Savage! - was such a wonderful guy, why, sure, he's a Jew but he says "antisemitic" things sometimes and he's on the "right" side of white issues, I kid you not. I nearly burst my gut laughing. This kind of invincible naivete cannot be cured in a few days or weeks, but requires years of effort to unlearn the conditioning we have been programmed with, and unless the lemming in question is willing to make the effort, it won't happen.

I don't know about the wisdom of Alex's tactics. He may be right that the porn thing is the right tactic to shock and motivate the 20-somethings. Maybe. But there is more than one "right" tactic and more than one target audience out there.

Excellent post, I'd really like to see many more discussions on this forum about lemmings because we need to fully understand their mindset in order to exploit it to our benefit.

I think it would be useful for us to think back to when we were lemmings. What was it that awakened us and brought us around? And I don't think many of us became both race-wise and Jew-wise simultaneously. First we became race-wise, then we became Jew-wise.

I think a strong sense of justice is a prerequisite for white nationalism. What we need to do is exploit that relentlessly. We should be prepared to ask white lemmings questions similar in nature to the following:

1. Why is it that you saw blacks looting in flooded New Orleans, but you didn't see whites looting in equally-flooded Grand Forks a few years ago?

2. Why is it that blacks showed their gratitude for the Civil Rights Act of 1964 by burning down so many of our cities during the late '60s (the purpose of this question and use of the term "gratitude" would be to plant in the mind of the lemming an image of blacks as "ingrates")?

3. If you really believe in affirmative action, would you personally be willing to give up your job to a black man to show your personal commitment (The use of this syntax is designed to challenge their intellectual integrity, which will put them off balance but open their minds)?

4. If you really believe in diversity, would you be willing to move into a black or Latino neighborhood tomorrow to show your personal commitment?

5. Do you think it's fair to put someone in jail simply because the express disagreement with the mainstream account of a historical event (a lead-in David Irving's victimization due to Jewish supremacism)?

6. Why is it that despite all the major outbreaks of genocide during the 20th century, the Jewish Holocaust alone gets the lion's share of publicity? Perhaps if the CEOs of Disney and Viacom were of Armenian ancestry, we would hear more about the Armenian Holocaust (a lead in to Jewish media domination and the commodification of the Holocaust).

We spend much time defending our positions. However, when dealing with white lemmings, we need to put them on defense on e in a while. Challenge their paradigms, their core values, their intellectual integrity, put them off balance, but then offer them the hand of fellowship to grasp onto and regain that balance.

I find when I ask lemmings these questions, very few of them have snappy rejoinders. Some are hostile, but many become confused and uncertain, as if these contradictions are the last things they want to think about. But this is when their minds can be open, when we take them out of their comfort zone.

Excellent post, I'd really like to see many more discussions on this forum about lemmings because we need to fully understand their mindset in order to exploit it to our benefit.

As Anchorage Activist notes, most of us were lemmings at one point in our lives. The problem is, it's hard to think back and understand the person we used to be. That's why it's frustrating to go over the same material again and again with clueless newbies. We've been there and done that. We want to move on to the next step, not be stuck constantly repeating ourselves to each incoming wave of newbies. But someone has to do it; it's like the schoolteacher's job. Teaching the same damn lesson every year to a new bunch of students. Maybe we could "automate" this task somewhat with new web tools.

Somebody should write a comprehensive introductory-level textbook. I want to at some point. I looked for such a thing when I first began considering WN ideas (about 6 mos. ago) but never found it; instead I learned by reading every one of Linder's old comments, the text of every one of Pierce's old broadcasts, everything by Revilo Oliver on revilooliver.com, Robert Griffin's bio on Pierce (actually, that was pretty comprehensive, covered a lot of ground), Kevin MacDonald's Culture of Critique (too specific and academic, but very good at that), Arthur Butz's Hoax of the 20th Century (very good and comprehensive on the Holocaust, even though the best summary in the book is at the end, in an appendix), Mein Kampf, plus lots of other stuff like forum posts. This kind of depresses me, because I seriously doubt most people would have the time and inclination to wade through that much stuff, so I think it's hard for people to get to this point.

The closest thing to a textbook I can think of is David Duke's books. I haven't read My Awakening; I started on Jewish Supremacism recently. I think the tone is too conversational, and more importantly, he gets into the Xtian stuff, which is a dead end. The rock-solid philosophical basis for WN is biology, not Xtianity. (JUDEO-Xtianity!)

Average white kids have seen this stuff by the time they're in junior high. You're the one who's offended, just like the jeboo clowns you hate. We're not aiming at you, we're aiming at 20-year-olds.

As if some 20 year old Whigger will become outraged over seeing a big fat nigger buck sodomizing a White girl. In case you have not noticed most 20 year old White males listen to nigger music, dress like them, talk like them and emulate them in every way possible. They have no problem with Niggers taking their women. I can imagine the average Whiggers reaction to your interracial porn collage: "You go boy". So who are you going to enrage with your graphics? Is it some straight laced, clean cut Mormon kid? I doubt it. He may become repulsed and immediately click off of VNN but chances are he won't be here in the first place.

So you must be telling us you are going to draw in 20 year olds by peddling porn. If they want porn they will go to porn websites.

Nothing you have done here is going to go beyond the choir. All you have done is aggravate the choir. You say Will is always right, apparently so are you.