Guys on here threatening each other, bragging about beating up cops, how much money they have made. I'd laugh my ass off, but the Jews and Feds have beat me to it, I am sure.

Again, I agree. All quite silly.

And let me make it clear -- fighting with the police is a mistake I made when I was younger, because I was involved in political activity that was wrong.

When I grew up, I stopped fighting with the police and abandoned my wrongful politics.

Given that I've got fifteen years of confrontational political activity behind me, including some very serious anti-social violence in my youth, and a number of attacks on my person just in the past two years, I find anyone who says I'm a push over to be more than a little ridiculous as well.

If anyone wonders:

I don't fight people unless I'm attacked, and I don't hurt them any worse than the law allows me to, which is generally not very much at all. I prefer to have the police solve problems, and I view any sort of violence as a last resort.

My provoking of certain people is exactly what RoguePostman says it is -- yanking their chains for the entertainment of those watching this argument.

We wouldn't we say anything ...

However, you are completely missing the point of what I was doing: which was illustrating the logical conclusion of the extreme anti-NSM statements and showing it to be ridiculous, and thus wrong.

How can I put this so you might understand?

If you're not so angry about the NSM uniforms that you are willing to fight our members and force them out of the rallies, then you don't really believe the NSM uniforms are that bad.

There. Does that help?

Ok you're still not tracking so let me get more specific.

Group X physically forces NSM out of the rally for the reasons stated above. Now does NSM begin referring to X as "traitors" and begins working against them at every possible chance? Or does NSM say, "We still disagree with the conclusions X made, but if they were willing to physically drive us out solely because they thought we were hurting the cause- we cannot condemn that...etc."

That's what I am getting at. The challenge itself is logical, but to conclude that the only reason why any group WOULDN'T do that is because they don't feel strongly enough about the uniforms is misleading. There ARE other reasons why other groups might not want to take that route.

I think the NSM is by far the most honest group out there. While Hal Turner says one thing on his website then tries to cry to the media he isn't a racist or supremacist, the NSM is outright about being racist and supremacist. 3 weeks ago, Hal said violence solves everything, then calls for a peaceful march. The NSM doesn't flip-flop like little Hal does. You know what you get with the NSM.

Hal Turner is the one trying to be politically correct. The NSM doesn't try to be.

I will give them that. Nobody can accuse me of being unfair. I've personally seen and/or heard about people who ended up getting a virtual bait-and-switch with groups like the National Alliance.

Hal did say he wanted street tough Skinheads to be there too.

See my remarks on theoretical internet battles.

You mean, JP's and, yeah, I agree with him about that. Subject dropped.

.

Good lord.

When you're ready to grow up, let me know.

Excellent answer. Almost up there with the response where you were called a rabbi

Again, someone completely lacking a sense of the ridiculous.

More dodging.

The National Socialist Movement supports unity. Unity does not mean we support people who want to declare us "opposition" and force us out of the white nationalist scene.

Can't tell by your postings. You attacked me and I have actually been somewhat supportive of NSM. Hell, ask JP, he and I have been round and round about it.

Try this thought:

If a few guys wearing uniforms are enough to focus the entire attention of the media on our organization, maybe there is something to the uniforms after all?

Yeah, kind of like Alice Cooper or KISS's attention.

Noone on VNNF is advocating anything illegal or libelous, if the NSM chooses to attend and attend Kingston in their reenactor uniforms, there's nothing that can be done about it, unless for some reason they're violating local laws dressed up like ass clowns.

That said, if they follow through and fuck up things, and we'll have a very reliable source for that, Yankee Jim, if his after action reports are that the NSM did damage, then I submit to Alex Linder and the VNNF moderators that the time has come to declare the NSM OPPOSITION, and treat them accordingly. The best solution would be as JP suggested, deny them what they most crave attention, and remove every post, thread, or mention of the NSM, and make VNN and VNNF an NSM free zone. That's not much of a punishment, but there needs to be some penalty for these ass clowns, and at the very least it should be that we'll no longer suffer their stupidity here among people who actually want to get something done instead of indulging in fetishism.

The Europeons have progressed farther than here because they've thrown off their outfits.

Anyone notice that I didn't use the term "fucktard" today? Someone PM MOMUS!

Goodnight everyone...without further ado...let me annoy the crap out of all of you with another stupid forum macro!

Congrats on no "fucktards" tonight, JP.

With that, I am going to post something that JP posted in another thread that Bill White would do well to read. It is based on some serious questioning I put to him about NS.

Originally Posted by deathtozog
Do they have any ideology classes or instruction for their members? I am actually asking serious questions here, JP. I am curious as to whether they are an adult JROTC club or if they are committed NS.

JP:
Other than the fact that NS was never about fashion, nor should anyone view it as being eternally tied to the Third Reich(this fact is agreed upon by Collin Jordan, Savitri Devi, and Povl Riis Knudsen- all three having done more for our race than NSM ever will), this is really more of a tactical issue than a matter of philosophy. As a whole, Teh M0vem3n7!!!1 needs a few seminars that are purely tactical in nature. Basically it works like this: WNs SAY they want this, this is what they are doing to achieve it currently, this is the result it's having, and here's why it's not working. It could rely on simple diagrams and charts like this:

NSM says it wants: Put NSM goals as stated by their literature.

Achieving these goals requires: This is based on the real-world political situation. For a hypothetical example, if they wanted legislative power via legal means, they would have to run successful congressional candidates. Our system says that the legislative branch makes laws- ergo unless you plan to change that system that it what you need to do to make the law.

What is NSM doing currently to achieve those goals, is this progressive, counter-productive, or neutral?: This also needs to be based in reality, not some bullshit alternative universe where NSM uses mental telepathy to force ARA members to incite blacks to riot.

Based on evaluations of actions, determine whether to continue certain actions, change actions, create new actions, etc.

That is just a rough framework but it would be a lot more than any WN org has done to date it terms of realistically evaluating our cause, goals, and means.

All rallies about the white race are about national socialism, because there is no struggle for the white race outside of national socialism. If the rally is not about national socialism, then it is about nothing.

White pride isn't about National Socialism. National Socialism didn't exist in America until after Ww II, yet we were successful, racist society. National Socialism is for Europeans. We're Americans and that means we're Capitalists.

The Europeons have progressed farther than here because they've thrown off their outfits.

I hope that Europeons was a mis-spelling. But whatever the case maybe, think again:

http://www.nsfront.info/

And unlike fakers such as Bill White, they maintain the battle is about race. Perhaps Mr. White will try to convince some skinheads who show up to marry some Indian women (high caste of course) in order to follow in the footsteps of his heroine.

Honestly, does anyone not get it that Bill White is a traditionalist pretending to National Socialism? And that being the case why are National Socialist allowing him to be their spokesmen?

Maybe if Bill White decides to move up a spot or two they can get George Burdi, who shares White's beliefs to replace him. They can be men above time, or men outer space, or what ever together. Perhaps Prozak can join them as NSM Party Philosopher. And since the White race is in no danger, as Mr. White claims, what the hell does it matter? We only exist that the god man White, the next avatar, and man beyond reality, can walk amongst us, shining down upon us his eternal light from the Godhead.

Bill White in one of his previous incarnations

The media is praying that a people will show up in SS uniforms, so they can show the images of Nazi Germany and jew corpses on the screens while they raise their arms shouting Heil Hitler. If not one Swastika shows up it will throw them off guard to say the least, they may still show the images but if no one is in Nazi uniforms then it will look out of place. And if more and more of these types of rallies happen with no Nazi uniforms I doubt the media will continue to show and portray us as Nazi's, just a hate group. I feel we need to distance ourselves from the Hitler and Nazi symbols.

My feelings on this doesn't mean I don't care for Hitler or Nazi Germany, or Hitlers vision. I just feel in this political climate these symbols damage us more than help us. I also have to say if anyone shows up to be photographed on national television, no matter what they're wearing has more courage than I do at this point in time. I'm in no position to go to rallies like this being portrayed as a Nazi. For one thing I wouldnt' have a job tomorrow, and I have to think of my family.

The faster these symbols dissapear the faster people will join this movement.

Correct. :cheers:

I hope that Europeons was a mis-spelling. But whatever the case maybe, think again:

http://www.nsfront.info/

And unlike fakers such as Bill White, they maintain the battle is about race. Perhaps Mr. White will try to convince some skinheads who show up to marry some Indian women (high caste of course) in order to follow in the footsteps of his heroine.

Honestly, does anyone not get it that Bill White is a traditionalist pretending to National Socialism? And that being the case why are National Socialist allowing him to be their spokesmen?

Maybe if Bill White decides to move up a spot or two they can get George Burdi, who shares White's beliefs to replace him. They can be men above time, or men outer space, or what ever together. Perhaps Prozak can join them as NSM Party Philosopher. And since the White race is in no danger, as Mr. White claims, what the hell does it matter? We only exist that the god man White, the next avatar, and man beyond reality, can walk amongst us, shining down upon us his eternal light from the Godhead.

Bill White in one of his previous incarnations

I meant the racists pols are mainstream in appearance.

Those niggers better stay out of my way, or I'll use my favorite Jean Claude Van Damme move on them.

The idea of universal human equality did not originate with Marx]

You are incorrect.

It originated in Christiandom, monks for instance were very fond of it.

Marx's version was a more heavy-handed version]

You are too worried about where Marx got his idea's. All great jews steal ideas. Marx was no different. What he was good at was selling it to the masses.

Capitalism dominates the world, get over it.

This is a complete falsehood.

The world's governments are overwhelmingly Marxist in nature.

You must think that State run Capitalism is not Communism, when infact, it is.

All men are equal- In the Marxist worldview this was base on the idea that divisions in race and religion were merely social contructs designed to hamper the international proletariat. Modern capitalism doesn't see it this way: Rather it sees man as "interchangable" if one can import 20,000 Turks into Germany to do a job and profit from it, this is fine- As long as it serves the economy and someone profits a native-born German is no more important to the German nation than the Turkish import.

What you reffer to isnt Capitalism. Its transitional Marxism.

The physical enemy, that is the establishment that exists and must be overcome, is unmistakably capitalist. If you want to attack their ideology, you will need to dig far deeper than Marx. The foundation for his beliefs became infused in the Aryan mind over one thousand years before he was born.

Your mind is confused from too many years of Marxist theory. Clean the cobwebs out, Capitalism, free enterprise, is not our enemy.

Marxism seeks to remove all boundries to all things universally, its in Marx's scribblings. That is not Capitalism.

Uniformed clowns do more damage to White people than the ADL. They do not even know what the REAL Nazis taught.

"The National Socialist doctrine, as I have always proclaimed, is not for export. It was conceived for the German people. A. Hitler

He did not say it was for the German people AND Kingston, NY. Obviously anyone showing up in upstate NY in 2005 claiming to be a "National Socialist" is either ignorant or a saboteur.